87 GN needing some help
 

Hello to all. First time posting on here so I will make sure I give as much information as possible.

Steve Sadek U.S. Marine (active) stationed at Quantico. Found this GN at Fredericksburg Auto Sales for $11K. Body looked great and overall was in good condition for her age. Didnt do my homework on venders and part reviews like I should have but cannot change that now. Here is a partial list;

1987 Grand National
98,500 miles
T-Tops
Stock Block
Stock Tranny
Stock Suspension
Hardened Stator
A bigger raditator that dosnt fit well
Cold air intake from GN1 Performance
3" SS Exhaust from GN1 Performance
Custom 66 Turbo and External wasgate down pipe from GN1 Performance
Turbonetics Boost Controller from GN1 Performance
Thumb Wheel with chip from ???
A/C delete with CRH Bracket
42lb Injectors
Hotwired fuel pump
Stock Intercooler
160deg Thermostat
LS1 Maf with Translator
There are a couple more things that were done but I do not have the email from the old owner anymore.

I replaced the stock turbo with the GN1 combo deal (wish I didnt but I did). Replaced valley pan and gasket, intake pleneum gasket, water pump gasket, downpipe gasket, turbo to header gasket, new intercooler hoses, t-bolt clamps, new fuel injector seals, new fuel rail seals, intake and exhaust. I put everything on myself.

She is smoking from the exhaust like a chimney, thick and white smoke. Smells real rich aswell. Once warmed up the smoke is less but still there. Had a few problems with boost controller and overbosted twice wich made my throttle body hose blow off and ruin a perfectly good hood liner. The check engine light comes on when i let off the throttle but goes away when on it. An older gentlemen mentioned to me that the head bolts are aftermarket so the heads were removed at one point. I didnt want to take the motor "apart" again but I am leaning to that route. Any help or ideas would be greatful as I was quoted $95 an hour for diagnosing fee. Thank you for your help and knowledge.

First off...
Welcome and thank you for your service !
Unfortunately heavy white smoke is tell tale of a head gasket issue.(water/coolant dumping into the exhaust side) Also check for antifreeze in the oil. (AKA milkshake the oil will turn white in color.) Both are symptoms of a head gasket letting go.
It sounds like the overboost got the better of you
Good luck
Mike

Take it from me a former king of headgaskets. Mikey is right, you've blown one.
Not necessarily a terrible thing. It can be fixed. Hopefully you don't have coolant in the oil. If you do, then it can ruing your bearings. If you do, drain the oil, drain all of the coolant, refill the oil, run it for a for a minute or so, without coolant. Change the oil again. That is what I did after I got milkshake oil. I didn't have any bearing problems.
Then replace the head gaskets, and before stepping on the pedal, drop the boost way down and gradually turn it up.
If you are handy with tools, then you can do the head gaskets yourself. Look and see id they are ARP head bolts.

Thanks guys for the info. I am pretty handy with tools, and usually can put everything back together again.

I took the intake manifold off as a whole with one shot. Intake, intercooler, turbo and downpipe are also removed. Valley pan, valve covers, headers, crosspipe and heads are out.

Found two cracks in my driver side headers. Took awhile to remove all the heat wrap from them. Almost spun the threads again in the hot side of the turbo. did that twice before.

Since I tore it down this far I decided to just keep going and take everything out and start over. Too bad since I have had her since Feb. and have only put on about 1000 miles. Might make this a build thread and show my progress.

How are you making out Steve? Find anything in there?

Since my last message I have been in the dog house after I told her how much headers can cost.

I havent been back to the garage to work on her since. Xmas is coming up and I need to get all the shopping done and get some brownie points back before I spend anymore money on the Buick.

As it sits now I am looking at the following to get back up and running;
Headgaskets
Headers
New fluids

What I need to get;
Scanmaster
Replace any more old vac lines

What I want to get;
Radiator that fits
TA-49
Different Exhaust
Different Downpipe
Service the Tranny

I will keep everyone in the loop if at all possible. Thanks again for all the help.

Don't bother with the headers. Just get them welded up. Save yourself some money, and it is getting too cold to be in the doghouse for too long.
I have a polished TE44 if you are interested.

Thank you for the advice on the headers and the offer on the TE44. I need to do some homework before I purchase anything else. Still upset with myself about the Custom 66 Turbo Combo.

I have alot of re-learning to do and even more hands on work to accomplish with this motor. I dont mind the cold seeing as I hail from the Superior State.

Besides I figure that Jack wouldnt mind someone purchasing parts from him, tis the season after all.

Any chance on sending in some parts for a discount? Or at least refering someone who can fix the tape deck, damn thing ate my Doors tape.

www.carradio.com

I have used them which much success on a few car radios they give a warranty and I think also they paid for shipping

Well, If you want the car original for shows and collect-ability, then by all means, stick with the original, but I think you should yank the stock unit, stick it on a shelf and replace with something more current.
There are tons of stereos out there that you can get for probably what it would cost to repair your tape deck. These radios will play music off of a flash drive, and some off of sd cards. Also they have audio inputs, so you can plug in your mp3 player, or iPod, and most now will actually control the iPod. Other features that they have are wireless remotes, so you don't even have to lean over to adjust, and they also show the name of the song playing on the drive/cd/iPod. Also, some have RDS that will show what is playing on the radio. You can also get HD radio, and Bluetooth for you phone, or wireless hookup to your music on your phone. There are tons of options. Get the wiring adapters, and there is no need to even cut the wires. Simple half hour job, and you can have modern music in your classic. Yes, Our cars are now classics. Pretty soon they will be called antique!

So with the heads off I am trying to clean all the fluid out. I didnt really want to go this far with a rebuild but I suppose I might as well.

Going to take the block off the tranny, put it on a stand and clean it all up. Inspect the tranny while im at of course. Take the oil pan off and replace the seal and whatever else I find in need of R&R.

Once I feel I did what I can I am going to get the parts I need and possibly if the misses lets me, put in an order for a new turbo and exhaust from Cotton. I am still disappointed with my first purchase but what can you do right. I will try to post some pictures of my progress.

Any input is always helpful

Sorry about the Doors tape, that sucks... don't get much better than the Doors.

Guess you're really digging into that thing... get some pics up, lets see that baby..

The pics of this project are way too big for the fourm. They will be posted on my facebook page if anyone is interested. Some of the shots are the parts that I am trying to get rid of or trade for some "in store credit", hint hint.

Hey everyone, just an update on the beast. Removed the block, took out the cam, crank, pistons, mains, timing cover, timing chain, Ect...

First things first, the timing chain only had one bolt holding it in and that was finger loose making the bolt hole hollowed out. New timing chain now needed.

The rear main seal was shot, the pistons are burned on top, the oil holes for the cam bearings were not lined up but i have read that some types don't require it. How can you tell though?

I don't know what to look for to make sure the components are good, like the block, rods, heads, pistons Ect...

I want to re use as much as I can to keep things original but don't want to miss something and have to take it all back apart. I saw a shop online called promar? Only $2500 for a complete motor shipped.

Any thoughts or ideas are highly needed. Thanks everyone.

Steve

Still would like some input on this project.

Morning Steve,

I hate saying sorry, but sorry I didn't respond sooner, no excuses.. but either way, I'm back. I never was good on email, a phone call is always the best way to get my attention.. but even that can be an adventure..

If you are needing to build a motor and looking for options, I would suggest using either us or a reputable Buick V6 builder. These 2500 shipped motor are more than likely just a basic, as cheap as possible, non turbo motor. You spend considerably more for a legit motor, but it will be right with quality parts. The cam bearings will most likely have a groove on the back side allowing the oil to get to where it needs to be no matter what the location. The main parts you could reuse are the rods, crank and block, depending on what the pistons are. We pretty much use only the diamond pistons when we rebuild. Are you pistons stock or have they been replaced and if so, what bore and brand?

I will check the pistons out tonight. I have noticed a few spots with some metal on metal friction. I will identify all the parts tonight and post them up. Any news on the journal hole in the block. My main concern is oil getting in there and loosening the bolts. I do not believe the engine was bored. I will take a look at the last owners upgrades email if I can find it.

1. Pistons
2. Pistons 2
3. Old and new turbo, trade both for a new TA-49... :D
4. Plate's three bolt holes are slightly hollowed out.
5. Crank and cam shafts.

1. Crank shaft wear.
2. Intake and CRH A/C delete
3. Block after alot of cleaning.
4. I have no idea what number four is. Oil supply line for turbo plugs in here.

1. Connecting rod
2. Inside of piston
3. Inside of piston 2
4. Side of piston
5. Cylinder wall

Shoot, everything looks pretty normal there, all stock parts. I didn't dig a block out yet, actually kinda forgot, but forgot because we are flat out.. Shake Gerry's tree and tell him to remind me to dig out a block and check.... :)

If everything looks good to you then I am feeling better. On that note, if i purchased new pistons should I bore it out to .20? Is that all that needs to be done to bore? new pistons and rings? Can I use the stock rods for the new psitons, and if so how do you dis-assemble them?

Found a shop local to me in Stafford, VA. He will be cleaning and boreing the block 20 over and inspecting all my other componets for servicability for $250. Is that a good price?

I will keep updates coming as I get them. Oh yeah, I will also be putting in a nice order to you Jack in the very near future. :D

That sounds pretty good. I still have to find a damn block and check that hole... it's just been nuts at the shop...

so i dropped most of my internals off at the machine shop. i was told the cam is shot and should go ahead and spend the money and get a Comp Cams kit. Since i want to re do this motor once and right i decided to go ahead and go with his suggestion. He mentioned the crank wasnt to bad and i can get it ground to a 10 - 10. He will be boring it 20 over and also clean the heads up and the intake and pleneum. the heads had ARP bolts so i will be re using them. New pistons and he mentioned new rods due to a new cam kit and new pistons.
Engine clean and bore $250
Crank grind $200
didnt ask about the heads getting cleaned up.

Does this make sense to you guys and gals?

Hopefully he has experience building our turbo motors otherwise it could turn out bad... As for parts,, if you want to do it right and do it once, I recommend our Roller cam kit, diamond piston and we have the Scat rods in stock... your builder should be able to get the King bearings, that's what we recommend. ARP main studs as well as some steel main caps.. give Gerry a call and he should be able to get you going, I'll be around if you need tot talk to me..

Need some help
 

Ok, motor is back in, sealed tight except for the crack in the manifold at the coolant temp sensor. I try to start her up and get a "puff" of pressure from the exhaust and the motor bogs the starter down. It will not start up and Im not sure what to do, I have no cam tool but it is degreed in per caspers instructions and others. primed the oil pump until lifters were getting oil.

everything is hooked up right, i do not have an EGR anymore or the solenoid, could that be a problem?

no heat or ac anymore either.

any and all help is greatly appreciated.